My original comment regarding an article sent to me by Andy posted at http://5ptsalt.com/2011/05/29/remember/
Although it may have already been said, i will reiterate…Let us remember that war is a tool for the rich to get richer, redraw the lines of nations and replace leaders to their benefit, to gather the power of the world to themselves at the expense of the lives of our fathers,mothers, brothers, sisters and neighbors. War has no benefits whatsoever as there are no enemies save those that are created by therich, powerful and underhanded to these ends. A “Christian” that supports war of any kind, save defending his family and neighbors from immediate harm, is, i dare say, no “Christian” at all.There are many who have or know family and friends in the military and forever cry to support the troops. I do not hate or despise them, but i cannot and will not support their mission to destroy life for no reasonwhatsoever. If I am despised for my opinion, then so be it as I do not find in the words of Jesus a justification for war of any kind on our part.As for those who have died in wars and conflicts I agree, “Do not only grieve for their loss but remember the lies and liars that killed them.”
You Say….and I quote…” I do not hate or despise them, but i cannot and will not support their mission to destroy life for no reason whatsoever”………I think very highly of all our members of the Armed forces as they protect the very freedoms you and I enjoy! And as far as I am concerned they can be as much a God fearing Christian as any of us!Sorry no matter the World Politics…. This one just hit a nerve. Forgive me but my opinion like yours will have to stand.God Bless You,Your Brother in Christ,James
*My response to James*
i think highly of these brave men and women myself brother, i was once in their shoes. I have no beef with them, it is the cause of their mission with which i disagree. They are sent as cannon fodder in an elaborate game of chess in which there are no winners. As I once stood in uniform, i can guarantee you that the military no longer serves the likes of our freedom, but only to keep grease in the war machine. everyday war continues, our freedoms decrease in the name of safety and security. I do not intend to defile the honor of anyone serving or having served. I am certain that there are Christians among those serving, but they have unwittingly allowed themselves to be used by evilmen for a cause they do not know. I knew when i sent this that i would strike nerves. I can only hopethat it causes those who see this to seek the truth in scripture and elsewhere.I am certain that your son is a fine Christian man, he does not want to be at war. It is the masters of war to which this is directed. I hope that he soon finds his way out of the military and lives a long healthy life with his family.With Love,
I have to agree with James on this. I don’t like war, I don’t condone war, I certainly don’t abide or enjoy in any way, shape or form, killing of another human being, but there are times, past and present, when war has been a necessity. I’m not sure there would be any Christian’s left in the world if not for war. This being said, I don’t always agree with our countries motives or tactics. I have many family members that are in or have been members of the armed forces, including my husband, all the way back to ancesstors in the Revolutionary War and I will continue to pray for our military members as well pray for peace. Your sister in Christ, Angie
*My response to Angie*
i was responding to an article sent by Bro. Andy http://5ptsalt.com/2011/05/29/remember/ . There are many people out there who think that these wars are keeping us free, but that is not true. our freedom is being stripped from us daily while our loved ones are “over there” being killed and killing…for what, “democracy”, I think not. why are we there in the first place…9-11, that was a lie. We are involved in never ending wars based on lies and deception, continuing to go place to place killing and being killed. There is no logical justification for this. I support our troops…bringing them home, that is. After rereading my comment, i really dont see the issue. As for Christians, all i said was that they don’t condone war. Do Christians go to war to free Christians? I don’t really see that in the teachings of Jesus. I do see, however, going on missions to prepare souls for death. This is a different battle. Imagine if we sent armies of missionaries instead of armed soldiers, imagine what would happen. By the way, i’m not calling everyone who is or has been in the military a non Christian as they have no choice in their “mission” and surely those who are Christians, do not support war, i would like to think. I’m referring in my comment about those leaders in the military and gov and some who call themselves “Christians” that I hear say things like…”look what those ragheads did to us, we need to turn them into a glass parking lot or kill them all” This is not love. I love you, Neal, and your family and James and his family and all my brothers and sisters in Christ. This comment was not meant to imply, nor did I say that everyone in or was in the mil is not a Christian and that we should not pray for their safety. Lets bring them home and stop this meaningless war.
Clear something up for me. Are you inferring that all wars are not worth fighting, or just the ones in which you do not agree?Choose your words carefully, your stomping on a lot of toes here.Sorry about the delay, I don’t get on here much any moreYour broher in Christ, Neil
I must say that I agree with you! He also said “save defending his family and neighbors from harm”, that area may be just a home, a neighborhood, a town, a state or a country. How do you draw the line. How many lives did we save by defeating Japan and Germany? How many wars did God ordain in the old testament to fulfill his will? How has Israel maintained it’s God given territory to fulfill his will for His chosen people and the revelations of Revelations?I’m afraid our brother is way off base here as a judge, saying present and past soldiers are no way Christians. Some of the finest Christians I’ve known were participants in the military and in wars. Retired judge, Jack Holt was saved prior to leaving for Europe in WW11 and piloted a B-24 over Germany surviving 25 missions. He was a man of influence to me in my early Christian life. A strong advocate of our Lord and Savior. He never proclaimed to be a hero, just did the job he had to do, as so many others did, to set men free.Every good thing we have is from our Lord, including being blessed to live in this free country. The gifts by his grace are to be cherished and we should not neglect the care we take of what he has blessed us with. Whether it’s our home, our health, our family and yes the land we are very blessed to live and worship freely in.Your brother in Christ,Paxton
*My response to Neil and Paxton*
Brothers, i dont agree with war at all, but mostly unjustified or unjustifiable war like we are in now. Unjustifiable meaning offensive war. Inimmediate defense of our families and i suppose by extension our country is, i would think, justifiable. btw, i’m saying no more or no less thanthe writer of this article > http://5ptsalt.com/2011/05/29/remember/ these conditions of war are being used to enslave us all by taking awa our freedoms in the name of security and safety which most say these wars preserve.
I think the thing that is upsetting most people is the comment about”Christians”. Let me be more clear. If a person in his heart or with his mouth, which usually tells what’s in the heart, uses the word “nigger”or “raghead” or “gook” or “spik” etc etc, Then in his heart he hates his neighbors. Same goes for war. If a person, wants to kill his neighbors for something they did not do, then that is a hate filled heart. But, on the other hand it could just be plain ignorance. I’ve heard people make comments over the years like “turn that place into a glass parking lot” and “kill those ragheads” and other such comments. I can only conclude that those people are not Christians from their own mouth. This is what I mean by supporting war.
I do not say that the men following orders are to be blamed or hated as I’ve said before, they are only following orders and should be upheld in prayer and support. The ultimate show of support would be to bring these men and women home to their families.
Lets also look at the examples that Jesus gave us. He told us to turn the other cheek. He also took beatings, mokeries and was killed by enemies and oppressors of the Jewish people without uttering a word in defiance. How much do we REALLY want to be like Jesus??
I dont know why i would be stomping on toes brother. I would also be stomping on my own. I was in the army too, so was my grandfather and my dad.
Supporting war and supporting the troops is two entirely differentsubjects.
to help understand a little better, I heard this talk show today and they mayexplain it a little better. Please listen to the attached file if youcare to.
also paxton, if you want to go back and talk about what’s in the oldtestament in the bible, i can bring up alot of laws and rules that most”bible believing persons” are not even aware, of much less follow…thingsthat we were told to do FOREVER. just like i hear people in churches say, a good Christian would tithe and go to church every sunday. wheredo they get that. mostly from the old testament, but when you say something about remembering the sabbath, then “we dont have to do that anymore”. it’s in the same old testament. so scripture is used when itbenefits people and ignored when it dont. You too make judgments everydayabout many things and people, some to which i have been privy. It justso happened that i made mine public for everyone else to judge, whichseveral have already done about my statements and certainly about me aswell.
Do you think that it is okay to go to war for anything that deprives us ofof our comforts or our “way of life”? What justifies war or killing another human? Wheredo we think we get the authority to make those “judgments”??
And when did i say that our past and present soldiers are notchristians. I never said that and I would not say that.
by the way, i’m planning to consolidate all of these conversations,including my comments and yours, and everyone else that comments orquestions, on my website for all to see and comment on. If you wouldlike a link to this post, let me know.
PS: Share this with someone you love…http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_LhXGo8dkg&feature=player_embedded
**any further interactions will be posted in the comment section of this post**
**the following podcast on PID Radio by Derek and Sharon Gilbert help explain my feelings on this matter**